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IR Landscape


12 years 2 months ago - 12 years 1 month ago #204499 by mj~shutterbugg
I am beyond baffled by IR. Not so much what to shoot but more how to post process. It's a skill and will take time. I also think my 50 mm 1.8 is rusty. May need replacing as the images feel a bit soft to me. ETA: this is way soft, I probably shouldn't even show it :unsure: CC always welcome.
Think Off-Center ~ George Carlin
www.mjbrennanphoto.com
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12 years 2 months ago - 12 years 2 months ago #204501 by mattmoran
The silhouette of the trees on the horizon looks sharp (at least at web resolution and on my screen). The clouds seem fuzzy, but I wouldn't expect clouds to look the same in IR.

If the lens produces sharp images with a non-converted camera, then you can rule out the lens as the issue. My experience with IR is 20+ years ago using IR film. I remember needing to adjust the focus. There was a red mark on the lens to the right (or was it left?) of the center line on the distance scale. Once I had focused the way I wanted, I adjusted the focus from the center line to the red dot. This is supposed to compensate for the fact that different wavelengths of light are refracted at different angles by the lens. Lenses are optimized for visible light. For infrared, you need to compensate for the increased (or is it decreased?) refraction.

If you lens doesn't have that red dot, you are going to have to figure out what the adjustment should be. Also, I'd keep the lens stopped down so you can maximize your DOF. That will make focus less critical.
-Matt
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12 years 2 months ago #204503 by Darrell
:agree:
You will not be judged as a photographer by the pictures you take, but by the pictures you show.
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12 years 2 months ago #204513 by Shadowfixer1
I prefer IR that shows off the IR. That would include foliage, water and clouds in the sky. Now that's just my opinion. I'm also not fond of color IR, but that's just me. Here a couple of samples of what I'm talking about. Processing in color is a different animal. Maybe I'm just lazy and just choose to go B/W for that reason but I think the critical thing in IR images is subject matter that shows off the IR effect.

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www.betterphoto.com/?ramshots
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The following user(s) said Thank You: mj~shutterbugg
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12 years 2 months ago #204568 by mj~shutterbugg
Shadow, that's just it, I don't know how to post process these images. I don't know what voice I want to use or what I want to show. I am hoping by sharing these images I get a better idea of what to do.
Think Off-Center ~ George Carlin
www.mjbrennanphoto.com
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12 years 2 months ago - 12 years 2 months ago #204645 by mattmoran
I assume you've done a google search for "infrared post processing tutorial" and browsed the results? It looks like there is a fair amount of free information out there. Most seem to assume you are using photoshop. I found one video that made extensive use of Nik software. What post processing tools do you have at your disposal?

As for what your voice you want to use, why not start converting the image to a "traditional" looking IR grayscale? An IR photo should have a very luminous quality, with glowing white foliage, black sky, black water, etc. Once you've got that down (with a few dozen images under your belt), you can start playing around with different color casts.

One thing I forgot to ask. Do you put a red filter on your lens when you shoot? I remember doing that with infrared film. Just because the sensor is shifted to be sensitive to infrared film, doesn't mean it won't be affected by non-infrared light. If you put a strong red filter on the lens (like a 92 or 93) that should keep the visible light from affecting the image.

Don't give up!
-Matt
The following user(s) said Thank You: mj~shutterbugg
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12 years 2 months ago #204694 by icepics
I'd wondered the same thing, if you were using a red filter. I plan to venture into trying some ir film and from what I understand without a red filter on the lens, even ir film will look more like standard B&W film images.

The sky looks so blue in the photo and I think ir usually looks more green, orange, teal, pink etc. I think ir film and red filters block blue light. Most of the resources I've found relate more to film, but I read that the time of day can make a difference - that low late day sun can give a stronger ir effect; that foliage different times of the year can be different - newer foliage has different amounts of chlorophyll etc. and being lighter green can make a difference in an ir photo.

Maybe aspects of light on a subject make a difference more with ir. When I'm shooting B&W film I tend to look for contrast of dark and light in a subject that might make for a nice B&W photo.

Maybe it would help to jot down settings and somewhat troubleshoot your process. I'm going to try it w/a rangefinder so I wouldn't be looking thru the lens, but I think with an SLR you might have the red filter on and off as you need to focus. I wonder too depending on how you set your camera if it's getting less light so you're getting too slow a shutter speed and maybe that's what's giving you less sharpness.
Sharon
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The following user(s) said Thank You: mj~shutterbugg
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12 years 2 months ago #204824 by robbie
I think for a beginner in PP Color Ir you should shoot images like the first one Randy[Shadow] posted,this image has too much sky with no clouds to dominate the scene.The clouds are blown as well,could be from processing.You went with the 'Super Color Ir Filter' from Lifepixel,I download the image that was shot using that filter and processed it but prefer the images from the 665nm filter but processing will take care of the differences.
Processing color Ir is very difficult so hang in there,somethings i`m stuck,I have no idea what to do.At that point I just save it and return later.
Getting the image is the main thing so this is my camera setup if you wish to use it,if you need help in processing just post a large unprocess file.
Camera setup.....Aperture Priority...at least F8 to offset the difference between visible and Ir,I normally shoot atF10 or smaller.
Metering...matrix/centerweight with -ec when clouds are present...+ec if lot of shadows but I shoot in Raw with 3 image bracketing on
ISO...100-200 for landscapes in sunshine....for birds inflight iso 400....
Shooting clouds you will want a fast shutterspeed so that you freeze any moving clouds.
Processing from Raw converter...
CS5...action...duplicate image/work on copy.....noise remover/channel swap [you have the method]
That will give you the typical white clouds/blue sky and white vegetation depending on your image.Playaround with Nik plugins,run it thru all the presets so you`ll know what you do with it.
You don`t have to do the 'channel swap' just go straight into Nik plugins and experiment with the plugin.
I recommended Viveza 2 to you because in my mind that`s a fantastic plugin when you know how to use it.To control those blown clouds all that is needed is a 'control point' and darken the image not to mention changing the colors on a selected part of the image...I uses Viveza 2
only to process to my visible light images before fine tuning in Onone and CS5 Exposure filter.
So MJ that`s my setup,if you need help just ask[you already knows that].
I refrain from commenting before because I don`t want to come across as a 'know it all',not that I don`t have confidence in my ability.
Hope this helps.
The following user(s) said Thank You: mj~shutterbugg
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12 years 2 months ago #204875 by mj~shutterbugg
Matt- I have Photoshop and Nik plug-ins. Sounds like I should be doing some google research. I tend to learn by doing and was doing what was recommended by LifePixel, but I am not happy with how "blue" everything looks. I haven't tried a red filter.

Sharon- I am obviously still learning what light the IR picks up and have found myself relying on the light meter, which I am hearing is a no no. I will be bumping my f-stops and shutter speeds.

Robbie- Your help is always welcome. I post here because I know I am lacking and looking for education. You know far more than me regarding IR and how to photograph with it as well as post.

This image is severely cropped, something I can't do on the IR body, as it is only a 6 megapixel Canon 10D. The original is a landscape, I will play on that one later and post my new results. I can't say enough how much I appreciate the honest feedback, knowing what is not working helps me turn it around to make it work. I much prefer honesty to being pampered. Learning is a process, and sometimes it is uncomfortable, but it is always worth it.
Think Off-Center ~ George Carlin
www.mjbrennanphoto.com
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12 years 2 months ago #204882 by robbie
Ever think of stitching your images mj,that would give you more options on cropping.Don`t think you need any filters on the camera.Which WB are you using,did you set a 'custom WB' by shooting the vegetation in the light that you will be shooting in?Setting different WB will change the color you get from the camera.
Just hang in there,knowing you,you will get it.
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12 years 2 months ago #204903 by robbie
To improve your processing please download the image of the filter that was installed at Lifepixel,i`ve downloaded it and currently processing it.Will post the images step by step as what filter I used so you can follow and get an understanding of my processing workflow.
The image from lifepixel is overexposed,will 'pm' you the link when i`m finished.If you don`t want to go that route and just work on your image,i`ll understand.
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12 years 2 months ago #204915 by mj~shutterbugg

robbie wrote: To improve your processing please download the image of the filter that was installed at Lifepixel,i`ve downloaded it and currently processing it.Will post the images step by step as what filter I used so you can follow and get an understanding of my processing workflow.
The image from lifepixel is overexposed,will 'pm' you the link when i`m finished.If you don`t want to go that route and just work on your image,i`ll understand.


Robbie, I am open to any and all ideas to get this. I won't have time to work on this till later, so I will be watching my pm's. My work PC is in my bedroom and I am alone with my kids so work must wait :)
Think Off-Center ~ George Carlin
www.mjbrennanphoto.com
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12 years 2 months ago #204921 by robbie
Sending in a few minutes,don`t bother download the image.Will include it.
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12 years 2 months ago #204938 by robbie
Please check your 'pm'
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12 years 2 months ago #204944 by Cappy
I agree with the OP, I think the whole image looks soft. The trees do not look like they are in focus, but they are less soft then the clouds. If this was a long exposure hand held, the image could be soft due to that.
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