Calculating long exposure times

12 years 7 months ago #149321 by Janos
I'm interested in doing some night time star trails and a little lost on something. Camera goes to 30 second shutter speeds before it goes into bulb mode. So let's say you have your camera in F/22 and it's pitch black out except for some stars. How do you determine your exposure time if your camera only goes to 30 seconds before bulb?


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12 years 7 months ago - 12 years 7 months ago #149325 by Shadowfixer1
Set lens to widest aperture and set 30 seconds on the shutter. Adjust ISO up from there to get an exposure reading. Calculate your stops needed to get back to the f-stop, ISO and shutter speed you want.
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12 years 7 months ago #149326 by Henry Peach
As far as proper exposure goes I'd rely on test shots and experience to determine that. It depends on what you want your finished photo to look like.

If you are looking to use the in-camera meter you can set it at the max aperture and max ISO, meter, and then calculate the stops difference between the ISO and aperture you plan to use. Set the aperture and ISO where you want them, and add all the stops to the exposure time. With digital each doubling of the exposure time is 1 stop. With film you would need to consult the manufacturer's info on reciprocity failure, and probably do some personal testing.
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12 years 7 months ago #149337 by Janos
OK so these sort of shots are based on trial shots?

Or with the camera's meter when you say max ISO are you talking about aperture is wide open at let's say 2.8, shutter is set to 30 seconds and I use my ISO setting to set exposure. Where the ISO lands that would be considered the max?

Any chance can would either of you have some figures to use as example?

I really appreciate your help on these questions!


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12 years 7 months ago #149340 by effron

Why so serious?
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12 years 7 months ago - 12 years 7 months ago #149357 by MLKstudios
Trial and error will be your best friend. Start with a low ISO and a middle aperture ( around f/8 ). Try a shutter speed of 15 seconds. If it is too dark add more time and too light, decrease the time (or use a smaller, higher f/number, ap).

HTH

f/8 and be there!!

Matthew L Kees
MLK Studios Photography School
www.MLKstudios.com
[email protected]
"Every artist, was once an amateur"

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12 years 7 months ago - 12 years 7 months ago #149359 by Henry Peach

Janos wrote: Or with the camera's meter when you say max ISO are you talking about aperture is wide open at let's say 2.8, shutter is set to 30 seconds and I use my ISO setting to set exposure. Where the ISO lands that would be considered the max?


If your meter suggests 30 sec @ f/2.8 @ ISO 3200 that's the same exposure as 8 hours 32 min @ f/22 @ ISO 100. 6 stops between f/2.8 and f/22. 5 stops between ISO 3200 and ISO 100. 11 stops total. Start with 30 sec and double 11 times, and if my math is correct it's 8 hours and 32 min.

I do some night photography, but not star trails. As the Earth rotates at the same speed for everyone you should be able to find example photos of particular exposure lengths.

I'm usually trying to reduce exposure time which may not be a good idea for star trails. I use ISO 100, and then set my aperture as large as it will go to get what I want in my scene in focus. If there is nothing in the foreground close to the camera I may be able to use fairly large apertures. Look into hyperfocal distance if you aren't familiar.

EDIT: Whoops, I think 30 sec to 8 hrs 32 min is only 10 stops. Double it again for 11 stops. :)
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12 years 7 months ago #149374 by Joves
Well with your D80 you can probably get away with a 3 minute exposure time before amp Noise shows up.You can test it easily enough by leaving on you lens cap and covering the View Finder. Take some long exposures start with 3 minutes then 3 and so on. Then look at the photos and the ones where there is a purple fringing around the edges show up is too long. You can then know how long you can keep the shutter open to get star trails. I would use an ISO 200 or 400 myself. Also you need to let the sensor cool for a minute or so between shots or you will get amp noise again. You can then late post process the images into one and have a nice star trails photo.


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12 years 7 months ago #149388 by Shadowfixer1

effron wrote: stevencastle.wordpress.com/2007/11/18/long-exposure-theory/
www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm

Good info in these.

A quick example. Let's assume an ISO of 100 is adequate to get a reading. If the lens you are using has it's widest aperture at lets say f-4.0 and you get a shutter reading of 15 seconds. Now you say you really want to shoot at f-22.0. Lets step it up from our known exposure. f-5.6 would take 1 30 seconds, f-8.0 would take 1 minute, f-11.0 would take 2 minutes, f-16.0 would take 4 minutes and finally f-22.0 would take 8 minutes.

Now if you can't get a reading at the above ISO 100 but you can at ISO 200, when you go back to ISO 100, just double the time. Lets say at ISO 200 you get 30 sec at f-4.0 which means it would be out of your meter range at ISO 100. To go from the ISO 200, 30 sec. at f-4.0 back to a ISO of 100, that setting would be ISO 100, F-4.0 for 1 minute. The you just go from there to get the shutter for f-22.0. It's real simple math once you understand the theory of stops. I may not be clear with my explanations, but I hope this helps.
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12 years 7 months ago #149391 by MLKstudios
Glad that's all cleared up. :)

Matthew L Kees
MLK Studios Photography School
www.MLKstudios.com
[email protected]
"Every artist, was once an amateur"

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12 years 7 months ago #149411 by Janos
You guys are great, I'm going to head outside and try this in a couple hours!

Now how can you tell how long a camera can have it's shutter open before the noise starts?

What are some good Nikon camera's that can keep their shutters open for longer time?


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12 years 7 months ago #149543 by Henry Peach

Janos wrote: Now how can you tell how long a camera can have it's shutter open before the noise starts?


Typical sensor noise starts immediately. It's just a matter of covering it up with plenty of signal (exposure). How long before other sorts of noise, such as that caused by the sensor heating up, depends on the camera. Once again personal testing is going to be your best guide.
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12 years 7 months ago #149594 by Kid Prodigy
This is a very informative thread guys :judge:

Canon EOS 7D|Canon EF 70-200mm F/2.8L USM |
Canon EF 50mm F/1.4 USM |
(2) Canon Speedlite 480EX II

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12 years 7 months ago #150356 by Janos
Yeah this worked! Just wanted to say thanks again for the help.


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12 years 7 months ago #150546 by Shadowfixer1

Janos wrote: Yeah this worked! Just wanted to say thanks again for the help.

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