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Fair Use Quandry


12 years 3 months ago #190370 by Baydream
Digital Photo Pro has an excellent article discussing "Fair Use" and copyright infringement by an attorney and professional photographer.
www.digitalphotopro.com/business/the-fai...n=DPPeNewsJan_011312
Shoot, learn and share. It will make you a better photographer.
fineartamerica.com/profiles/john-g-schickler.html?tab=artwork
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12 years 3 months ago #190372 by Shotw3ll
Long article, I'll have to read later but thanks for sharing. I don't get the Digital Photo pro magazine.
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12 years 3 months ago #190407 by mattmoran
That is very interesting. I'd never heard of that case before.

For the other side of the issue: waxy.org/2011/06/kind_of_screwed/
(Note this article actually includes the images in question.)

Personally I think Biao's argument is persuasive. Lewis comes off as an attorney telling us not to get upset by the fact that lawsuits are expensive.
-Matt
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12 years 3 months ago #190410 by icepics
I've read/heard about this before. I think as along as the copyright is still in effect the photographer would be able to enforce the copyright on his work. The artist got permission for usage for the music but not the cover art which obviously needed to be done. At some point the copyright would expire and then it would be public domain, but I think that would be years down the road.

As this writer says (Lessons to be Learned) the key thing is to get permission and work out compensation for usage.
Sharon
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12 years 3 months ago #190411 by Baydream
It is long (3 pages). I went to the site and requested email updates. Most of the mag is available online (check on the above link).
Shoot, learn and share. It will make you a better photographer.
fineartamerica.com/profiles/john-g-schickler.html?tab=artwork
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12 years 3 months ago #190416 by photobod
Interesting article and a difficult issue, I have just raised a thread about the use of music on slideshows, it will be interesting to hear views on both these subjects.
Personally I think Maisel is being a bit of an arse but hey its his right I guess.
www.dcimages.org.uk
"A good photograph is one that communicate a fact, touches the heart, leaves the viewer a changed person for having seen it. It is, in a word, effective." - Irving Penn
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12 years 3 months ago #190426 by icepics
Jay Maisel is a well known and well established photographer to have enough clout to pursue it; most photographers wouldn't have the money or resources to pursue copyright violations. The pixel art is recreating the photo so that it's very recognizable, it might be different if someone did a drawing of Miles Davis maybe in the same blue color scheme but not the same image.

It's the same thing as doing artwork/design or writing an article, there's a reasonable expectation of being compensated for the work. For any work, for that matter, I didn't work as a teacher without a paycheck. If I wanted to do volunteer work with kids, or donate one of my photos for use by a charity, that would be my choice.
Sharon
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12 years 3 months ago #190428 by mattmoran

icepics wrote: The pixel art is recreating the photo so that it's very recognizable, it might be different if someone did a drawing of Miles Davis maybe in the same blue color scheme but not the same image.


This is the part I disagree with, and this issue is why I did a google search to try to find the original and derivative images. IMO the pixilated version is somewhat equivalent to someone making a sketch of the Mona Lisa. It is a new image and not a reproduction of the old one. And as such, it should be fair use and not covered by the original copyright.
-Matt
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12 years 3 months ago #190435 by icepics
That could be the debate, to me it's recognizable and an altered photo, as soon as I saw the altered image I knew it was Miles Davis 'Kind of Blue'. And something like the Mona Lisa would be public domain, no copyright left after that many years! - even though I don't think there were copyrights that far back. Copyrights and I think trademarks etc. expire after a certain period. Once Maisel's copyright expires then that photo would be public domain and anyone could use it I believe.

It's like if I wrote an article, someone could write a similar story on the same topic, but couldn't change a few sentences of my article and have it republished, it would be my writing but in an altered form. The artist altered someone's photo but not to the point that it is no longer recognizable.
Sharon
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12 years 3 months ago #190440 by mattmoran
I basically agree, but I don't think "recognizable" is the right standard. I could write a novel about a boy who finds out he has magic powers and is invited to a special school where he meets interesting characters and has adventures. It might be recognizable as derived from Harry Potter, but as long as its significantly different, then copyright claims by J.K. Rowling should not be an issue.

I think the pixel art version of the photo is significantly different, even though it is recognizably inspired by the same image. I might make a sketch of the Mona Lisa (or a Worhol if you like -- I'm sure his visual works are still protected by copyright) but it would be a different image. And in my opinion that should be fair game.

What a judge or jury would decide, I don't know.
-Matt
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12 years 3 months ago #190692 by photobod

mattmoran wrote:

icepics wrote: The pixel art is recreating the photo so that it's very recognizable, it might be different if someone did a drawing of Miles Davis maybe in the same blue color scheme but not the same image.


This is the part I disagree with, and this issue is why I did a google search to try to find the original and derivative images. IMO the pixilated version is somewhat equivalent to someone making a sketch of the Mona Lisa. It is a new image and not a reproduction of the old one. And as such, it should be fair use and not covered by the original copyright.


I am inclined to agree with you Matt :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
www.dcimages.org.uk
"A good photograph is one that communicate a fact, touches the heart, leaves the viewer a changed person for having seen it. It is, in a word, effective." - Irving Penn
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12 years 3 months ago - 12 years 3 months ago #190713 by icepics
Reading a little more about it, a copyright infringement decision is based in part on purpose of usage, whether it's commercial/money-making or not. They also take into consideration how much/what part of an image is used.

Basically the image is Maisel's, it belongs to him and was copyrighted. The artist's work wouldn't even exist without use of that photo. Now if someone used their own photo and recreated it in another form that would be different. In this case the artist didn't do a portrait of Miles Davis, he make a portrait of someone's photo.
Sharon
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